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Pardon me!
July 5, 2007 - 5:20pm — F.R. Bronco
I'd like to be pardoned for a felony offense...wouldn't that be nice? I don't propose to hurt anyone, I won't steal from anyone either. I simply want to gain financially with inside information to the tune of several million dollars. Victimless crime, I figure. And if I get caught, all I want is to be pardoned, or at least have my sentence commuted, so I don't have to go to jail. How do I get a deal like that. I'm not particularly upset by the idea that Bush abused his presidential power, it's a time-honored tradition. Today the White House defended the commuting of Scooter Libby's sentence by pointing a finger at Clinton and the 140 he pardoned. Clinton's spokespeople, including the Mrs., argue the Bush commute is more heinous than any of Clinton's. I'm not sure who looks more self serving after exercising his executive privilege. Thankfully I'm not a card carrying (cash depositing) member of any political party, so I don't automatically have to defend one or the other. Thankfully I don't have to defend the Bush administration, I'm not sure how you can do that with a straight face. But the latest executive decision by Bush has made me ponder why we allow one person, simply because of an election that is held just once every four years – we elect mayors more frequently, for crying out loud – to wield such power, unchecked. It seems like that power has become a tool of abuse by every occupant of the White House. Most abuse it in their final days. Bush couldn't wait that long, clearly, since he had to pay his buddy back pronto. I'll bet Libby knew all along this was coming. Is it time to repeal the right of presidential pardons?
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You think President Bush was...
Back to page topYou think President Bush was wrong to commute an excessive punishment? Libby was wrong, no question about it, but the sentence was off the chart. Keeping in mind Clintons 141 pardons, Bush's pardon was pretty insignificant. If Libby was a murderer or rapist or sold State secrets, I would have no pity for him. I think it is pretty minor compared to the people Clinton pardoned...let me call you a whaaa-mbulance, cuz even tho you say you don't belong to a particular party, you seem to lean very left.
One nation under God
F.R.(left...
Back to page topF.R.(left leaning)Bronco,
You think Slick Willie (Mr President) did nothing wrong when he pardoned scumbags like Mark Rich?? A man who cannot even come back into this country? And what about Bill's buddy who stuffed the top secret documents into his shorts and socks?? I guess that's "nothing" compared to Mr Libby? All Libby did was mention the name of a "has been" secret operative, who wasn't even in a covert status at the time. Remember, she was a has been, ready for the junk heap of spy's. Remember, Pres Bush, only got rid of the jail time, but Mr Libby still is ruined! Unless, GW grows a pair, and pardons him. But as you say, thats the way they ALL work in D.C.!! No matter what we say, they will continue to be corrupt (all parties included).
I questioned the value and...
Back to page topI questioned the value and necessity of a presidential pardon in light of the latest sentence being commuted by Bush. I never said I thought one president was better or worse than another in this regard.
I know I wouldn't want to have to defend the Bush administration given what a mess this country is in, so if that makes me liberal in somebody's tiny, narrow-minded world, so be it.
Both of your comments seem to make far too many assumptions while failing to answer the question I posted, is the idea of presidential pardons outdated? If you two want to simply rant on behalf of a political party, feel free, but don't expect responses from me. I asked a question, not for your ill-informed conclusions.
Former resident of Borderland, now calling Indiana home.
F.R.Bronco, When someone...
Back to page topF.R.Bronco,
When someone posts something as you did, it leaves alot of grey areas, as to whether or not you are "gigging" a particular party or official of that party. You mentioned that Ms Hillera, even thinks Bush's commutation is worse than any of slick Willie's! In your introduction, you listed some of your wishes as regards to receiving Presidential favors. In those wishes, you obviously were referring to the Scooter Libby guy. Why didn't you have any wish list items, from slick willie's 141 pardons? Why not be like Mr Mark Rich, who can't come back to this good ole USA? I don't expect you to have to defend President Bush, as you shouldn't expect me to defend JFK or LBJ, who played a major role in a similar war/campaign, that they didn't end in three or four years, but instead let it drag on and add 57 thousand names to a "WALL"! Bush has a long way to go, to break their record of adding names of dead soldiers to a memorial!! Just think about what a mess the Dem's got this country in (many more years than Bush). As for Presidential pardons, I agree with you, that an overhaul/update of the whole pardon process needs to be done ASAP!! It definitely needs some system of checks and balances, so that it has some resemblance of fairness. That is all for tonight.
If you look back on my...
Back to page topIf you look back on my reaction to the Clinton pardons of about 7 years ago you'll see...
Oh, wait, this site wasn't available 7 years ago.
I can promise you that I would have appreciated a pardon 7 years ago for crimes I could have committed then, too. I can also guarantee you that I was outraged by Clinton's abuse of the presidential pardon. As I noted, there's a long history of that abuse, and I'm not interested in the end of that abuse simply because of Bush cutting his buddy Libby a break. It's only the latest example of an antiquated presidential power that has my blood boiling.
FYI: I find it hilarious that Hillary has an opinion on Bush's abuse of his power. If any Democrat should keep her mouth shut, it is her.
For the sake of argument, let's assume that Clinton's pardons were more heinous. (Not exactly a stretch.) Am I not permitted to be outraged today that Bush cut Libby a break? Of course I am. That doesn't make me left leaning. I may be, but the latest insult upon our judicial system doesn't tell you which way I lean, if I lean at all.
As I noted, I am not beholden to either political party. I have a good friend who is a raging Republican. I don't talk politics with him because in the end it doesn't matter what happens. He may not approve of specific actions, but he would never disagree with the party line, which to me is the equivalent of drinking Kool-Aid. I have a friend who drinks Democrat Kool-Aid, too.
News flash: No party is right 100 percent of the time. It seems that some don't acknowledge that, and that drives me nuts.
I enjoy not being beholden to any party. It is so pleasant to be able to choose my candidate in a partisan race by their statements and positions rather than the letter that appears next to their name.
I'd be ashamed to let a letter determine who I'm voting for.
And for the record, raj2000, my example of wanting to be pardoned had nothing to do with what Libby was convicted of in a court of law. I was not asking for the same treatment as Libby, I want to commit a financial felony and be let off the hook. I find it hard to believe my desire is obviously a reference to Libby.
Former resident of Borderland, now calling Indiana home.
F.R.Bronco, I am a "card...
Back to page topF.R.Bronco,
I am a "card carrying" Republican, but if you look at my entries from months ago on here, you will see that I tend to be more of a Libritarian. I have said I would vote for Joe Biden tomorrow, if he was (and should be) the nominee. I still don't understand what skeletons he has in his closet, that makes the Dem's not want to back him. As for Libby, Bush said that Libby was found guilty by a jury, but that the jail time was unnecessary. But you and I both know that a pardon will come on or before Jan, 2009! But we can argue all day long about the inequities of the way each party uses and abuses the system, but at the end of the day, all we will have is sore fingers from typing on our keyboards. Washington D.C. will continue to run this country into the ground, and until the people stand up to the old cronies, and only then, will we have some positive change. Another thing we need, is term limits for ALL of congress. If you or I don't do our jobs, then we will be out of one. Same should go for most of the elected losers in D.C. My only hope is that I live long enough to see Bill and Hillary outed, exposed and convicted for all of the crimes and murders they have had committed. I don't think he can remain "slick willie" forever!!
I am with you in most of...
Back to page topI am with you in most of what you wrote. You lost me at the end, big time, and I don't want a clarification. I choose to ignore it and move on.
As for term limits, I'm somewhat torn. We have it for the Oval Office, but not Congress. Although some argue elections provide term limits if we want to use them for that purpose.
Former resident of Borderland, now calling Indiana home.
F.R.Bronco, I won't clarify...
Back to page topF.R.Bronco,
I won't clarify the deeds of Mr. & Mrs Clinton. History will do that for me, and ALL "left wingers" will be sad when they read the "truth" about this couple!! Why not term limits for congress?? How about if the Republicans are in power, then what about term limits???? I don't think ANY job should be for life. Most of Congress is corrupt and in the back pockets of big business, and need to be booted out of office. Nuff said!!
Former resident of I-Falls, now calling USA Home!!
I don't think anyone (who is...
Back to page topI don't think anyone (who is trying to be honest, which excludes politicians, of course) would argue with the corruption of congress and politicians in general. They have voted themselves too much power, not to mention all the raises and perks they give themselves. It is disgusting beyond belief and such a blatant abuse of power and authority is just screaming out "prison terms!". The Supreme Court and the Justice Dept should be ashamed at their lack of over-site...as well as POTUS.
I could go on endlessly about this but in your case I would be preaching to the choir.
Keep up the good work.
One nation under God
RJ1127 Klloyd, I agree in...
Back to page topRJ1127
Klloyd, I agree in general with your statement re corruption in politics, but I do think that initially most politicians enter the system with good intentions. However, early on they fall prey to the vast financial clutches and pressures of the extreme positions of the political party extremists on both ends of the political spectrum and rather quickly begin to compromise their personal ideals and morals.
Deserve Victory.
RJ1127 I think you are...
Back to page topRJ1127 I think you are mostly correct. Most politions have the best of intentions starting out. How does that saying go...power corrupts absolutely. Absolute power corrupts absolutely....something like that, anyway.
One nation under God
RJ1127, You hit the nail on...
Back to page topRJ1127,
You hit the nail on the head!! My observations are, that some of the few who don't fall into the trap, see the BS going on, and get the heck out of there after a term or two. So it's just like life it's self, the bullies and corrupt people run everything, and alot of the good people are pushed aside. Has happened for hundreds of years, and wil continue. A good example was former congressman J.C. Watts, who ran on a pledge of a two term limit, but ended up serving four terms. But he saw the BS going on and bailed out. Unless, he had some skeletons in his closet and got out while he could. But it was a shame to lose such a good Congressman who could have gone on to bigger and better political positions. But instead we have Obama!
RJ1127 roj2000, I like J C...
Back to page topRJ1127
roj2000, I like J C Watts as well. A very plain spoken guy. Like you I wonder why he left, and if it was only for his personal commitment. I hope so. He has kept a rather low profile since public office. I know he is involved in the Fellowship of Christian Athletes, but I don't know what else.
I do have constant hopes that somehow the silent majority in this country (middle 60%) will eventually become a bit more openly involved in politics at all levels. They seem for the most part to be common-sense based, somewhat conservative, socially concerned, nice folks. But, they tend to wait to speak up until it is too late. I keep waiting for the 'common-sense' party to emerge.
roj2000, take a look at www.Unity08.com. Is this a step in the right direction? Maybe it is IF we can keep the inflammatory rhetoric down to a calm and somewhat orderly discussion of the topics of the day.
Deserve Victory
RJ1127, Looked at the...
Back to page topRJ1127,
Looked at the Unity08 website and I find it very interesting!! You asked if I thought it was a step in the right direction, and my answer is, sure looks like it. Anything to show the Dem's and Republicans that none of them are accomplishing a darned thing in D.C. So I think it is time for the "majority" of us to rise up and throw them ALL out. But what do the politicians care if they are thrown out of office? They will just go on to lobby the new members of congress, unless the "newly elected" are strong and don't fall into their traps. I'm ready to vote for Mayor Bloomberg of NYC. He is a billionaire and doesn't need the "payoff" money, so he can tell it like it is, and doesn't need corporate America's money to run a campaign.
One Nation under a Third Party President
I though Anton was minding...
Back to page topI though Anton was minding the shop while I took off for Michigan and I punch up the journal to find the kids running things again, suggesting that voting for rich guys is the best policy because they won't rip us off. They obviously haven't been paying attention. Italy did that recently and they got a rich guy who made all white collar crime a misdemeanor. Not exactly beneficial for the public good.
I say we start electing college professors instead of lawyers if we want honest government. I basically vote for politicians who aren't obvious liars and Paul Wellstone got more of my votes than anybody. Along with Bob Dole, who wasn't a professor but would have been a great one. As for the Joe Biden? He cheated his way through some of our best colleges and universities; alongside Ted Kennedy. If Professor Condie hadn't tied her wagon to a lying VP Cheney,she might have made the Honesty Party. Too late for that now; Colin Powell told enough whoppers to the United Nations to keep him out forever. And anybody who thinks that cheatin' Rudy or lying Romney have a chance getting endorsed at our convention in Independence Missouri is sorely mistaken. We're as honest as the days are long -- and we're talking about Minnesota days, not those brief southern ones.
TLJ, Glad to see you back!!...
Back to page topTLJ,
Glad to see you back!! Thank God someone dug up some dirt on Joe Biden. I knew he had to be a snake, since no one wanted to back him. As for Italy, I never trusted an Italian anyway!! Poor ole Colin Powell, he only did what the SOB's told him to do. And Condi, she needs to stick to playing piano and playing the College circuits. What's wrong with Rudy? Other than he is a crossdresser who kicked butt on the Maffia. But tell me more about Romney's lies. I kind of like him, but don't know that much about him. You didn't mention Mayor Bloomberg, or the "dark horse" from Tennessee, Fred Thompson. Either He or CD Rudy will be elected. Bet you a Coca Cola!! What convention are you talking about, GOP, Dem or Independent?? Why would Bob Dole want to be POTUS? He makes more money pitching Viagra, than he ever would as President!!